Im comfortable in my warm bed. A neighbouring country is being bombed by an empire the OP is shilling for and deing war crimes commited. Your moral high ground has been noted tho.
I am afraid you have committed two logical fallacies. A whataboutism and an ad hominem. I am therefore declaring myself victorious in this debate and taking the last word.
I leave you with this final thought: Have you considered that two things might be bad at once? Think about it.
If I was suporting one imperialist invasion and prettending the other one is not there that would be fair. OP spent last few years denying whats going on in Ukraine.
It’s a really bad look for folks still insisting that Ukraine is the correct side to associate defending it and criticising Russia with minimising this one. “What about the white people?” At least pretend to be consistent.
You mean the exact kind of ceasefire your own government imposed on Gaza? Where do you people think you are, cyberspace? You are in hell you absolute nematode. Good way to show you have never once looked at the Russian demands. This isn’t even current event literacy. You’ve had four years, and all you do is keep repeating your same ignorant remarks like they mean something. It would be better to prepare for what’s coming with that time. I already solved your problem for myself and I don’t care to help you much.
My goverment? Not sure it has any meaningful inpact on actual european politics, but being the neocons they are I tend to be against most anything they stand for or do. Which gives me about as much agency as Russian communists have in their state. Your point being?
I do know the Russian demands more or less, and they call for dismounting most meaningfull lines of defence by giving away key stronghold cities. Sounds very much like a suicide when dealing with a state that every time lies about their intentions. Also loved the peace offer with Russian right to veto any actions in defence of Ukrainian territory. In regards of prep for whats comming dont worry. Russia can not defeat the most corrupt, weakest of the big states in Europe. Also they used to have much more sympathy in Ukraine then they do here. Most of their support base is far right and these will be dealt with when the time comes.
Financial involvement isn’t apolitical man. Scandinavian and Baltic countries are enthusiastic imperialists. More rhetorically, if you’re going to support the Ukrainians not surrendering, committing terror attacks, torturing people, etcetera, don’t cry about the consequences.
You seem to ingore the entire line of argument you yourself started about the supposed peace treaties? Did you just find out their absurd terms?
And mate, both Poland and the Baltics pull much more from EU than we pay in, so that particulqr take might be the worst possible one. Also calling Baltic states imperialist is some next level detachment, but id be interested to hear the justification here.
Also just out of pure interest; would you consider historical event of Polish underground “home army” blowing up a train station in Berlin to sabotage nazis justified? Not their proudest moment, some civilians died, but I would.
Uh, why would I want to rehash an argument about the ceasefire agreements where Ukraine keeps asking for concessions it has zero leverage to achieve. You don’t ask a guy who has you in a headlock if you can fuck him in the ass real quick. You know, we’re going to be here for years. When all is said and done, the reality of Ukraine’s military failure will reflect poorly on those who asked them to keep waiting for a Wunderwaffen US military fix to their quagmire which can never come. My dear Baltoid (if I recall correctly?? Finn maybe?), the US is now expending interceptors on Iranian missiles. Where does your hope spring from lmao
Oh, you got any arguments not used by USA to justify Iran, Irak, Venezuela and soon Kuba invasions? Im really fascinated by how you belive this is any different.
Lol covering your ass ahead of time because you presumably know about the 8 years of ethnic cleansing by us-backed nazis, but think that you can both-sides it if you pretend that documented reality is the same thing as whole cloth propaganda. Truth is the difference. The US lies about bad things happening to justify aggression against a rival, and the US also does bad things and lies about them not happening to justify aggression against a rival. The common denominator here is American imperial lies, and the fools who keep swallowing them.
Here’s a CNN segment from 2015, before mentioning the slaughter of eastern ukranians by their own junta government became politically inconvenient for the west:
do you deny the last 8 years of Banderite terror before “evil RuZZia attacked us poor peole unprovoked”
you’re like fucking zionists who think hjistory started on oct 7
Yes I don’t think that happened, if Russian people had been oppressed in Eastern Ukraine then they would have moved just several miles east into the open arms of Russia and been safe. They would hardly have stayed if they felt in danger. I do know someone who made the mistake of staying put in Bucha when the Russians arrived and saw them murder civilians in the street.
if Russian people had been oppressed in Eastern Ukraine then they would have moved just several miles east into the open arms of Russia and been safe
Thank you for admitting that you, just like the Nazi regime in Kiev, dream of ethnically cleansing Eastern Ukraine. Just like the Zionists want to do in Gaza. No wonder they say they want to be a “larger Israel”.
Why should people who are native to that land and have lived on it for generations move? They stayed and they fought back and defended their homes and their land.
Also, citing obvious false flag atrocities committed by the Nazi side that you support isn’t the win you think it is.
wow negationism, a good old nazi practice.
Never mind the facts or reporting on it before the western regime press suddenly had to say ‘no nazis in ukraine’
most people leaving ex-ukraine actually went to Russia instead of leeching of the west.
And no, they don’t need to move because the nazi thugs attacked them.
And lol at Bucha, the ridiculous BS story where the mayer is laughing a day after Russia left and 3 days later they suddenly find a massacre.
And the victims just happen to wear (pro-Russia)white armbands and had Russian food boxes.
This when the nazi Safari regiment was sent in to clear the area of ‘Russian collaborators’.
So fuck you nazi revisionist.
Again it’s those fascist thugs that did the warcrimes.
But you keep supporting the great EU/US side.
Unappologetically on the side of shitrael genociders and mass mrdering Iranian children.
disgusting
I heard the details of the Bucha massacre first hand from a none Ukrainian relative who witnessed it first hand so I am as confident as I can possibly be with that one… I am also very much not in favour of bombing Iran or Gaza. I have a strict not in favour of murder or war whoever does it stance… the idea that any oppressed Russian could easily have popped across the border to Russia to be safe is just my own logic admittedly I have no good knowledge or what may or not have been occurring in eastern Ukraine before.
a none Ukrainian relative who witnessed it first hand
That makes it second hand.
If have zero confidence in his impartiality.
And I am confident of the FACTS I mentioned since they were reported by the mayor of Bucha himself and their own pictures and videos.
None of it makes sense with their fantasy story.
And why din’t those oppressed ukrainians just hop over the border to Poland to be safe?
Where are you coming from here? Sure you don’t believe my brother in law eye witness the way I do, that’s fine but are you saying you don’t think Russian soldiers and missiles have killed hundreds of Ukrainian civilians during the invasion? And as you already said many civilians have fled abroad, my brother in law did have that option it was just plain foolishness that meant he tried to ride it out in Bucha before he was rescued by Ukrainian soldiers. And if I had been Putin and I wanted to safeguard the Russian speakers in Donbas then I would have given everyone of them a visa and an apartment in Russia, I assure you it would have been easier and several billion dollars cheaper than his invasion…
You ever been to Ukraine or Russia? Ive been crossing that border. If there was any meaningfull opression in eastern Ukraine people would run to Russia and be happy to be refugees. Eastern Ukraine was poor as fuck and western russia was a massive potemkin village, some 50-100km into Russia looked great, compared. Nearly EU level. Only when you get beyond that you get tp see the actual state of the country, and even the areas where money is pumped lools more lile american slums.
Oh, and yeah nazis from Ukraine should be dealt same way the Russian ones. Fuck banderites, amd fuck anyone who attempts to label an d stogmatise entire society by one minority group, an utterly nazi thing to do btw.
they bombed them for 8 years, a lot worse than “meaningfull opression”.
All civilian targets.
And why should they run from their own country and let it be taken over by Banderites? A lot left, a lot stayed.
Same on the other side.
The economic situation is irrelevant.
As in all western propaganda ypu minimize the scope and influence of Banderites.
Nazis don’t magically change their ideology because the Azov scum change their nazi logo a bit as we are made to believe.
Also they, as most visible and blatant are describesd as unique and an exception.
While there are plenty fascist batallions like Sich and Tornado.
There are plenty more outside of the military and they have infested others with their ideology when they joined other instances of society.
And here’s the nr 1 challenger for Zelenski should they have elections in ‘free and democratic’ ukraine.
I’m not saying everyone in ex-ukraine is a fascist but minimizing and whitewashing their huge nazi problem as is done here in the west is disgusting.
but that is of course the easy way for the US and vassals of getting regime change without fighting.
Arm and fund terrorists of all kinds in countries they don’t like.
Whether it’s fascists or headchoppers like Jolani, etc…
Later to be rehabilitated when they take over a country and become a puppet regime.
Yeah, and yet theres no proof for that claim in satellite or aerial pictures. Should look like the surface of the moon after 8years. Compare to any village or city Russian offensive rolls over, theres hardly a wall standing.
And why should they run from their own country and let it be taken over by Banderites?
Thought they were Russians and part of Russia since forever? Can you settle for one version of the propaganda claims?
As in all western propaganda ypu minimize the scope and influence of Banderites.
Where are you from mate? Cuz actuall Banderites slaughtered tens of thausands of people in my country. I often travel around a region where ethnical cleasing from both sides left hundreds of villages abandonded and covered by forrests. Being antifa its rather hard not to take that into consoderation, especially when cooperating with our comrades in Ukraine. Now who the fuck are you to claim to know what is going on? Where are you active and what are your sources on information on this? What gives you the right to question the people actually dealing with this?
Will you post the ones from Ukraine as well?
Ooh, ooh, I know the thing you’re supposed to say here!
Ahem:
Whataboutism
europissants when people talk about someone else:
Im comfortable in my warm bed. A neighbouring country is being bombed by an empire the OP is shilling for and deing war crimes commited. Your moral high ground has been noted tho.
I am afraid you have committed two logical fallacies. A whataboutism and an ad hominem. I am therefore declaring myself victorious in this debate and taking the last word.
I leave you with this final thought: Have you considered that two things might be bad at once? Think about it.
Oh i did. You just forced yourself onto someone pointing out exactpy that to the OP. Have a nice day.
Well two wrongs don’t make a right. Food for thought.
in your funeral, instead of your loved ones reading your eulogy, they should bring up that other people died too and focus on them instead.
If I was suporting one imperialist invasion and prettending the other one is not there that would be fair. OP spent last few years denying whats going on in Ukraine.
It’s a really bad look for folks still insisting that Ukraine is the correct side to associate defending it and criticising Russia with minimising this one. “What about the white people?” At least pretend to be consistent.
But here are some dead civilians in Ukraine to satisfy your urge to secure the future of white children or whatever: https://nexusnewsfeed.com/article/geopolitics/burned-alive-how-the-2014-odessa-massacre-became-a-turning-point-for-ukraine/
You mean the ones your leaders have denied a ceasefire? We already have. Extensively.
Would you support a “ceasefire” in Gaza where Israel gets all it wants and can change conditions of anytime they want?
You mean the exact kind of ceasefire your own government imposed on Gaza? Where do you people think you are, cyberspace? You are in hell you absolute nematode. Good way to show you have never once looked at the Russian demands. This isn’t even current event literacy. You’ve had four years, and all you do is keep repeating your same ignorant remarks like they mean something. It would be better to prepare for what’s coming with that time. I already solved your problem for myself and I don’t care to help you much.
My goverment? Not sure it has any meaningful inpact on actual european politics, but being the neocons they are I tend to be against most anything they stand for or do. Which gives me about as much agency as Russian communists have in their state. Your point being?
I do know the Russian demands more or less, and they call for dismounting most meaningfull lines of defence by giving away key stronghold cities. Sounds very much like a suicide when dealing with a state that every time lies about their intentions. Also loved the peace offer with Russian right to veto any actions in defence of Ukrainian territory. In regards of prep for whats comming dont worry. Russia can not defeat the most corrupt, weakest of the big states in Europe. Also they used to have much more sympathy in Ukraine then they do here. Most of their support base is far right and these will be dealt with when the time comes.
Financial involvement isn’t apolitical man. Scandinavian and Baltic countries are enthusiastic imperialists. More rhetorically, if you’re going to support the Ukrainians not surrendering, committing terror attacks, torturing people, etcetera, don’t cry about the consequences.
You seem to ingore the entire line of argument you yourself started about the supposed peace treaties? Did you just find out their absurd terms?
And mate, both Poland and the Baltics pull much more from EU than we pay in, so that particulqr take might be the worst possible one. Also calling Baltic states imperialist is some next level detachment, but id be interested to hear the justification here.
Also just out of pure interest; would you consider historical event of Polish underground “home army” blowing up a train station in Berlin to sabotage nazis justified? Not their proudest moment, some civilians died, but I would.
Uh, why would I want to rehash an argument about the ceasefire agreements where Ukraine keeps asking for concessions it has zero leverage to achieve. You don’t ask a guy who has you in a headlock if you can fuck him in the ass real quick. You know, we’re going to be here for years. When all is said and done, the reality of Ukraine’s military failure will reflect poorly on those who asked them to keep waiting for a Wunderwaffen US military fix to their quagmire which can never come. My dear Baltoid (if I recall correctly?? Finn maybe?), the US is now expending interceptors on Iranian missiles. Where does your hope spring from lmao
there you go https://aroundus.com/p/164923678-alley-of-angels
Are you asking about the Ukranians civilians killed by Russia or something else?
Ukrainian, or really all, civilians killed in the conflict instigated by Russia.
Know how I know you weren’t paying attention?
Oh, you got any arguments not used by USA to justify Iran, Irak, Venezuela and soon Kuba invasions? Im really fascinated by how you belive this is any different.
Lol covering your ass ahead of time because you presumably know about the 8 years of ethnic cleansing by us-backed nazis, but think that you can both-sides it if you pretend that documented reality is the same thing as whole cloth propaganda. Truth is the difference. The US lies about bad things happening to justify aggression against a rival, and the US also does bad things and lies about them not happening to justify aggression against a rival. The common denominator here is American imperial lies, and the fools who keep swallowing them.
Here’s a CNN segment from 2015, before mentioning the slaughter of eastern ukranians by their own junta government became politically inconvenient for the west:
https://youtu.be/sK_5KthQTHk
A choice quote since I know your ass isn’t going to watch it:
That would be equally bad.
OP spent last few years denying whats going on in Ukraine.
do you deny the last 8 years of Banderite terror before “evil RuZZia attacked us poor peole unprovoked”
you’re like fucking zionists who think hjistory started on oct 7
Yes I don’t think that happened, if Russian people had been oppressed in Eastern Ukraine then they would have moved just several miles east into the open arms of Russia and been safe. They would hardly have stayed if they felt in danger. I do know someone who made the mistake of staying put in Bucha when the Russians arrived and saw them murder civilians in the street.
Thank you for admitting that you, just like the Nazi regime in Kiev, dream of ethnically cleansing Eastern Ukraine. Just like the Zionists want to do in Gaza. No wonder they say they want to be a “larger Israel”.
Why should people who are native to that land and have lived on it for generations move? They stayed and they fought back and defended their homes and their land.
Also, citing obvious false flag atrocities committed by the Nazi side that you support isn’t the win you think it is.
wow negationism, a good old nazi practice. Never mind the facts or reporting on it before the western regime press suddenly had to say ‘no nazis in ukraine’ most people leaving ex-ukraine actually went to Russia instead of leeching of the west.
And no, they don’t need to move because the nazi thugs attacked them.
And lol at Bucha, the ridiculous BS story where the mayer is laughing a day after Russia left and 3 days later they suddenly find a massacre.
And the victims just happen to wear (pro-Russia)white armbands and had Russian food boxes.
This when the nazi Safari regiment was sent in to clear the area of ‘Russian collaborators’.
So fuck you nazi revisionist.
Again it’s those fascist thugs that did the warcrimes. But you keep supporting the great EU/US side.
Unappologetically on the side of shitrael genociders and mass mrdering Iranian children.
disgusting
I heard the details of the Bucha massacre first hand from a none Ukrainian relative who witnessed it first hand so I am as confident as I can possibly be with that one… I am also very much not in favour of bombing Iran or Gaza. I have a strict not in favour of murder or war whoever does it stance… the idea that any oppressed Russian could easily have popped across the border to Russia to be safe is just my own logic admittedly I have no good knowledge or what may or not have been occurring in eastern Ukraine before.
That makes it second hand.
If have zero confidence in his impartiality.
And I am confident of the FACTS I mentioned since they were reported by the mayor of Bucha himself and their own pictures and videos.
None of it makes sense with their fantasy story.
And why din’t those oppressed ukrainians just hop over the border to Poland to be safe?
Where are you coming from here? Sure you don’t believe my brother in law eye witness the way I do, that’s fine but are you saying you don’t think Russian soldiers and missiles have killed hundreds of Ukrainian civilians during the invasion? And as you already said many civilians have fled abroad, my brother in law did have that option it was just plain foolishness that meant he tried to ride it out in Bucha before he was rescued by Ukrainian soldiers. And if I had been Putin and I wanted to safeguard the Russian speakers in Donbas then I would have given everyone of them a visa and an apartment in Russia, I assure you it would have been easier and several billion dollars cheaper than his invasion…
You ever been to Ukraine or Russia? Ive been crossing that border. If there was any meaningfull opression in eastern Ukraine people would run to Russia and be happy to be refugees. Eastern Ukraine was poor as fuck and western russia was a massive potemkin village, some 50-100km into Russia looked great, compared. Nearly EU level. Only when you get beyond that you get tp see the actual state of the country, and even the areas where money is pumped lools more lile american slums.
Oh, and yeah nazis from Ukraine should be dealt same way the Russian ones. Fuck banderites, amd fuck anyone who attempts to label an d stogmatise entire society by one minority group, an utterly nazi thing to do btw.
they bombed them for 8 years, a lot worse than “meaningfull opression”.
All civilian targets.
And why should they run from their own country and let it be taken over by Banderites? A lot left, a lot stayed.
Same on the other side.
The economic situation is irrelevant.
As in all western propaganda ypu minimize the scope and influence of Banderites.
Nazis don’t magically change their ideology because the Azov scum change their nazi logo a bit as we are made to believe.
Also they, as most visible and blatant are describesd as unique and an exception.
While there are plenty fascist batallions like Sich and Tornado. There are plenty more outside of the military and they have infested others with their ideology when they joined other instances of society.
And here’s the nr 1 challenger for Zelenski should they have elections in ‘free and democratic’ ukraine.
I’m not saying everyone in ex-ukraine is a fascist but minimizing and whitewashing their huge nazi problem as is done here in the west is disgusting.
but that is of course the easy way for the US and vassals of getting regime change without fighting.
Arm and fund terrorists of all kinds in countries they don’t like.
Whether it’s fascists or headchoppers like Jolani, etc… Later to be rehabilitated when they take over a country and become a puppet regime.
Yeah, and yet theres no proof for that claim in satellite or aerial pictures. Should look like the surface of the moon after 8years. Compare to any village or city Russian offensive rolls over, theres hardly a wall standing.
Thought they were Russians and part of Russia since forever? Can you settle for one version of the propaganda claims?
Where are you from mate? Cuz actuall Banderites slaughtered tens of thausands of people in my country. I often travel around a region where ethnical cleasing from both sides left hundreds of villages abandonded and covered by forrests. Being antifa its rather hard not to take that into consoderation, especially when cooperating with our comrades in Ukraine. Now who the fuck are you to claim to know what is going on? Where are you active and what are your sources on information on this? What gives you the right to question the people actually dealing with this?