By “trustworthiness” do you mean continuing to try to vote our way into policy which benefits the American people? Because that hasn’t worked in 40+ years.
Yeah I’ll take a “dictatorship” like China if it means we get socialized Healthcare, 25,000 miles of high speed rail, affordable housing and nationalization of corporations who have received billions if not trillions in subsidies. American “democracy” certainly hasn’t delivered on any of that.
Yeah I’ll take a “dictatorship” like China if it means we get socialized Healthcare, 25,000 miles of high speed rail, affordable housing and nationalization of corporations who have received billions if not trillions in subsidies. American “democracy” certainly hasn’t delivered on any of that.
Ask the Uyghurs how that’s working out for them. Anyone who thinks a fascist dictatorship doesn’t eat whoever they want is lying to themselves. If you’re not a party man (and even if you are that isn’t a bulletproof vest) you’re not going to have a life worth living.
I bet nazi germans were cool with living in the reich, too. Just look at all those jewish companies they were given! Who wouldn’t want that. /s
You’re going to have to come up with a counter benefit we don’t also have under U.S. “democracy”. Unless you think there is no comparison? I’d be happy to discuss that with you.
Then move to China, because the chances of a dictatorship running your way are next to zero. Dictatorship means no accountability, so once it’s set up, they do as they please no matter what you say.
If I spoke mandarin fluently and had a solid support network of friends and family i would. 🤷♂️
Dictatorship means no accountability, so once it’s set up, they do as they please no matter what you say.
Show me all this accountability here in the United States. A known pedophile is in office and the previous guy in office spent four years giving a huge number of his voters the finger.
I was making an assumption you couldn’t see your own bullshit but this is you acknowledging you’re fully aware of it.
Losing an election isn’t real accountability for being a pedophile and you know it. And you know as well as I do Trump will never see the inside of a prison cell.
You seem to like when the government heavily censors domestic media, the internet, and academic discourse, and actively suppresses political dissent, protests, or criticism of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). Movement within China is regulated. The justice system in China has a 99% conviction rate…for whichever side supports the side of the state. Mass surveillance with no legal recourse. You wouldn’t even know if you had it good or not. Unless you are fine not knowing I suppose.
The west also heavily censors domestic media, the internet, academic discourse, and actively suppresses political dissent and protests, etc. The critical difference is that the west does this to protect capitalists against the working classes, while China does this to suppress capitalists and protect the socialist system. The class that controls the state uses it to oppress the others.
People criticize, institutions are censored. Protests also do happen infrequently. China is a pretty stable country overall because the system actually works.
(No idea what they’re trying to say tbh. Is that an edited image or… are they calling you out? Seriously unclear)
PODS is an opinion poll. The way you present it implies that it speaks in any way to the actual systems of government of the country in question, when that’s just straight not what it’s about:
[…] At the same time, more respondents said their country was moving in the wrong direction. The report finds that pessimism is especially pronounced in democracies. France, Germany, Lebanon, Puerto Rico and Nigeria were among the countries where responses on national direction were most negative. China recorded the most positive responses, followed by El Salvador, Kuwait, Algeria and Belarus.
What the infographic you’ve posted actually shows is that Chinese citizens are among the most satisfied with their government, which is for sure something, but is decidedly not the same thing as:
China is one of the more comprehensively democratic countries on the list, with some of the fewest glaring weaknesses.
Yes, of course it’s a survey of how people feel about their systems. Most western “democracy indexes” just define democracy loosely around whatever the Nordics are doing, and as such countries with very different democratic systems like China score very low. This shows that that’s not really accurate, the people of China like the system and believe it delivers well for what it does.
Well, yes - this is an opinion poll, it’s not a measure based on real metrics of performance, it’s entirely based on perception.
Which is my whole point: you stating that china is among the more comprehensively democratic countries on the list is a misuse of the infographic. You might hold that opinion, it might be true, but the image you’ve posted is completely disconnected with supporting that claim.
How would you measure how comprehensively democratic a country is, if not by asking people how well it functions in getting across the will of the majority?
Thanks for the link, my point was that posting random pictures without context/methodology/sources is not very helpful.
So the questionnaire asks people how positive/negative they perceive the categories in their own country, I’m not really sure that methodology works very well for oppressive countries.
You can look into their methodology. While it is an imperfect method, it does track pretty well when comparing countries to each other, as well as seeing which countries have more glaring weaknesses than others. It’s already widely reported that over 90% of people support the government in China, so this tracks pretty well.
It’s better in many ways than the standard western way of simply defining democracy by whatever the Nordics are doing, and then ranking everyone else accordingly. China has a very different democratic model than western countries, and so usually fails a lot of checks that are only checking for norms within western style democracies. This ranking helps take into account differences in model towards more socialist democracy by checking how the people feel.
He definitely is elected, just not directly. The Chinese President is elected by The National People’s Congress. The Presidium, which is the body that presides over the NPC when the full body Is not in session, nominates one or more candidates, and then the whole NPC deliberates and votes
North Korea has a nominally more direct electoral system than China, though it’s equivalent to the Chinese President is the President of the State Affairs Commission, which Kim Jong-Un holds.
These are head of state positions which, while influential, are more insulated from the day-to-day operations of governance.
That said, we have a much better window into what Chinese political culture is like, as well as the robustness of its institutions, as compared to the DPRK. So it’s more difficult to say, one way or the other, what the DPRK’s politics are truly like.
That said, these thought terminating cliche’s don’t help you or anyone else. Its worthwhile to learn how these systems work.
Also, Indirect elections aren’t inherently bad. The prime minister of the UK is also indirectly elected, but that fact alone tells us very little about the UK’s political culture, institutional responsiveness to the popular will, or how able institutions of governance are able to weather crises
By “trustworthiness” do you mean continuing to try to vote our way into policy which benefits the American people? Because that hasn’t worked in 40+ years.
Yeah I’ll take a “dictatorship” like China if it means we get socialized Healthcare, 25,000 miles of high speed rail, affordable housing and nationalization of corporations who have received billions if not trillions in subsidies. American “democracy” certainly hasn’t delivered on any of that.
Ask the Uyghurs how that’s working out for them. Anyone who thinks a fascist dictatorship doesn’t eat whoever they want is lying to themselves. If you’re not a party man (and even if you are that isn’t a bulletproof vest) you’re not going to have a life worth living.
I bet nazi germans were cool with living in the reich, too. Just look at all those jewish companies they were given! Who wouldn’t want that. /s
You’re going to have to come up with a counter benefit we don’t also have under U.S. “democracy”. Unless you think there is no comparison? I’d be happy to discuss that with you.
Why would i engage with someone who believes china is more free than the US?
Then move to China, because the chances of a dictatorship running your way are next to zero. Dictatorship means no accountability, so once it’s set up, they do as they please no matter what you say.
You actually think there’s no accountability in China? My guy, they hold their politicians to a much higher bar then we do.
If I spoke mandarin fluently and had a solid support network of friends and family i would. 🤷♂️
Show me all this accountability here in the United States. A known pedophile is in office and the previous guy in office spent four years giving a huge number of his voters the finger.
If it was a total dictatorship, he’d be there forever. Accountability is the elections. You have hope.
Then who are prisons for?
Tell you what, I’ll wait here until you find a question you actually can’t answer yourself.
I was making an assumption you couldn’t see your own bullshit but this is you acknowledging you’re fully aware of it.
Losing an election isn’t real accountability for being a pedophile and you know it. And you know as well as I do Trump will never see the inside of a prison cell.
Pathetic.
Yep, your “bullshit” and pathetic" language checks out. You are so way off topic now I can’t even throw you a lifeline. Cheers anyway.
You seem to like when the government heavily censors domestic media, the internet, and academic discourse, and actively suppresses political dissent, protests, or criticism of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP). Movement within China is regulated. The justice system in China has a 99% conviction rate…for whichever side supports the side of the state. Mass surveillance with no legal recourse. You wouldn’t even know if you had it good or not. Unless you are fine not knowing I suppose.
The west also heavily censors domestic media, the internet, academic discourse, and actively suppresses political dissent and protests, etc. The critical difference is that the west does this to protect capitalists against the working classes, while China does this to suppress capitalists and protect the socialist system. The class that controls the state uses it to oppress the others.
Can you openly criticize the Chinese party in control? Can you protest without violent retribution?
People criticize, institutions are censored. Protests also do happen infrequently. China is a pretty stable country overall because the system actually works.
People can openly protest the party in control in a city center? They can openly access the world wide internet?
Yes, and yes. VPNs are accessible. Institutions trying to foment regime change are cracked down, simple protest is not generally.
You’re responding to my comment where I said.
You didn’t show me where all this accountability is. Was that an oversight on your part or are you acknowledging there isn’t any?
Can you openly criticize the Chinese party in control? Can you protest without violent retribution?
You can do these things in the usa. Accountability.
China won’t let the full intent through. The US does. Accountability.
You think a few no kings protests around the country means the pedophile Donald Trump has been held accountable for his crimes against humanity?
I guess that answer means no?
You chose to respond to my comment and I’m still waiting for you to show me where all this accountability is. 🤷♂️
From the recent Perceptions of Democracy survey:
China is one of the more comprehensively democratic countries on the list, with some of the fewest glaring weaknesses.
cool… cool…
This data is public, and was gathered by western organizations. You don’t have to make stuff up.
(No idea what they’re trying to say tbh. Is that an edited image or… are they calling you out? Seriously unclear)
PODS is an opinion poll. The way you present it implies that it speaks in any way to the actual systems of government of the country in question, when that’s just straight not what it’s about:
What the infographic you’ve posted actually shows is that Chinese citizens are among the most satisfied with their government, which is for sure something, but is decidedly not the same thing as:
Yes, of course it’s a survey of how people feel about their systems. Most western “democracy indexes” just define democracy loosely around whatever the Nordics are doing, and as such countries with very different democratic systems like China score very low. This shows that that’s not really accurate, the people of China like the system and believe it delivers well for what it does.
Well, yes - this is an opinion poll, it’s not a measure based on real metrics of performance, it’s entirely based on perception.
Which is my whole point: you stating that china is among the more comprehensively democratic countries on the list is a misuse of the infographic. You might hold that opinion, it might be true, but the image you’ve posted is completely disconnected with supporting that claim.
How would you measure how comprehensively democratic a country is, if not by asking people how well it functions in getting across the will of the majority?
Thanks for the link, my point was that posting random pictures without context/methodology/sources is not very helpful.
So the questionnaire asks people how positive/negative they perceive the categories in their own country, I’m not really sure that methodology works very well for oppressive countries.
You can look into their methodology. While it is an imperfect method, it does track pretty well when comparing countries to each other, as well as seeing which countries have more glaring weaknesses than others. It’s already widely reported that over 90% of people support the government in China, so this tracks pretty well.
I did, my opinion is that obviously that’s not a very smart way of conducting the questionnaire.
It’s better in many ways than the standard western way of simply defining democracy by whatever the Nordics are doing, and then ranking everyone else accordingly. China has a very different democratic model than western countries, and so usually fails a lot of checks that are only checking for norms within western style democracies. This ranking helps take into account differences in model towards more socialist democracy by checking how the people feel.
Russia… Democratic… LMFAO xDDD
Thanks for sharing!
This was an edited picture, the one I posted has Russia near the bottom.
Ah shit, my bad. Ignore me
No worries!
Xi is a de facto dictator. Sham elections and all
Xi is not directly elected
Xi is not elected*
He definitely is elected, just not directly. The Chinese President is elected by The National People’s Congress. The Presidium, which is the body that presides over the NPC when the full body Is not in session, nominates one or more candidates, and then the whole NPC deliberates and votes
Sure he is “elected” just like in north korea
North Korea has a nominally more direct electoral system than China, though it’s equivalent to the Chinese President is the President of the State Affairs Commission, which Kim Jong-Un holds.
These are head of state positions which, while influential, are more insulated from the day-to-day operations of governance.
That said, we have a much better window into what Chinese political culture is like, as well as the robustness of its institutions, as compared to the DPRK. So it’s more difficult to say, one way or the other, what the DPRK’s politics are truly like.
That said, these thought terminating cliche’s don’t help you or anyone else. Its worthwhile to learn how these systems work.
Also, Indirect elections aren’t inherently bad. The prime minister of the UK is also indirectly elected, but that fact alone tells us very little about the UK’s political culture, institutional responsiveness to the popular will, or how able institutions of governance are able to weather crises
You unironically are saying there are legit elections in NK. Oh boy, you are a hoot