Looking for some testimonials on these setups as I’m due for a keyboard upgrade. I like the thought of spreading my arms a bit more and the external wrist rotation from the tenting. Any suggestions?
I was the IT Director for a company that had a lot of data entry people. I had noticed that the keyboards that they were using were mostly plain jane, mismatched, membrane keyboards. After a bit of back and forth with purchasing I convinced the company to purchase a ton of mechanical (cherry reds), split ergonomic keyboards.
Within a month RSI reports were down by 95% and after 2 months were essentially nonexistent. I also noticed that people had stopped wearing wrist braces as well. I paired this with good, well shaped mice that would hopefully lead to less fatigue with repetitive motion.
My sample size is tiny, but there are 30 some odd people who if asked, would back me up on this. So while not thoroughly scientifically proven, I am willing to say that ergonomic keyboards do make a big difference. I think mechanical makes a pretty big difference too. Cherry reds activate with very little pressure and, imo, make typing long documents or notes much less annoying/stressful/painful/
While I do not use tenting or physically split keyboards, I have been using ergonomic split keyboards for ~16 years. Not sure if that exactly fits the category you are looking at.
The specific keyboards have been the Microsoft natural ergonomic keyboard 4000, Microsoft Sculpt, and Logitech ERGO K860. I’ve been gaming on the PC since the early 90s and have been in IT and software development for ~26 years.
I have had no issues with carpal tunnel or RSI. While I obviously cannot say it was 100% due to the split keyboard design I believe it has likely helped to keep those issues at bay. Once you are used to a split keyboard design you can feel the pitch and stress on your wrists when using a standard keyboard. I have also always used the riser that rises the wrist end of the keyboard so you fingers are sort of “falling” down toward the keys.
I used that Microsoft 4000 keyboard for years, cleaned out the membrane on it 2 or 3 times before I had to replace the entire keyboard. Then was left hunting for something to replace it; I tried a lot of keyboards. In the end I’ve settled on the Logitech K860.
I have a pretty similar bio except I’m not into gaming. I will say the feeling of going to a non-split keyboard is immediate now. I’m at a phase in my career where I’m in meetings all day so I don’t mind it was much when it happens but a few years ago I’d be having wrist pain after a couple of hours of working on a standard keyboard.
I tried the sculpt as well but found it was having issues with key repeat or just losing connectivity so I went back to a wired keyboard (MS Natural).
Any thoughts on why the Logitech is better or were you just ready for a change?
I had the exact same issue with the Microsoft Sculpt, it would disconnect much too often. There is a setting in Windows that sort of helped it but not fully. I also missed the standard cursor keys placement (home/end/pg) and the number pad as I will often punch in some numbers or even hit the enter key over there just to mix it up a bit.
The Logitech is a full width/key keyboard so cursor manipulation muscle memory is great, that was something I was still getting used to on the Sculpt. The Logitech does not disconnect as much as the Sculpt and there are no repeat key presses, it does however still disconnect at times and it is most obvious when trying to copy or paste. Overall the Logitech is the board I like best since the natural 4000.
If there was pie in the sky I’d like a full key, ergonomic split, wired, and hot swap keys so I can just fix any key that has an issue in the future. I searched high and low for that combination and haven’t found one that checks all the boxes. There are split mechanical keyboards but they are always missing a feature like: not hot swap, short the cursor keys, have shuffled the cursor keys, or dropped the number pad. There is one mechanical keyboard that comes extremely close but the keys are not hot swap.
I’m not a big fan. I am somewhat of an outsider with a preference for trackballs over mice, though. MX ERGO FTW
I’ve built several. They are worth every penny. Not only reduced pain in the hands, wrist, and forearms. Also in my shoulders. I’m a fairly wide human and split tented allows you to place the separate parts at a more natural distance for shoulder/arm width.
My mother eve ended up stealing my last build. She’s not complained since and travels with it for work.
As a builder, would you say there’s a somewhat budget pre-built option that’s decent that lazy and curious people like me can look at?
I’m not having a lot of trouble with my body with the regular keyboards, but they do force.me into specific positions when I have to do actual work, because I need both sides of it rather than just the gaming one when I play.
Of the pre-builds you are going to be looking in the 200-300 range for any of the Ortho range. But to get started you could look at the Kinesis. They are in the 100-200 range, offer tenting and are split. Can often find them used on eBay as well. This was my entry into the custom keyboard world. Beware that rabbit hole though, it’s deep and can get super super expensive.
I’ve been using a Microsoft natural keyboard since 1998. I switched over to the Elite when they came out and I have several spares stockpiled. They helped a lot with the wrist comfort and honestly they improved by typing by enforcing which fingers press which keys.
I have a hard time using a straight keyboard, not because I can’t adapt but because they’re just plain uncomfortable. So when a thing hurts when you do it then you stop doing it. You’ll see.
I printed out and mostly built a Dactyl keyboard but never got around to finishing it because work is super picky about what USB devices can be hooked up to our machines and QMK firmware will absolutely look like a mouse jiggler to their security scanning software. I had to unplug a frickin’ volume knob because it was alerting every day as a security risk or something.
I’ve been usung a Moonlander for a couple of months after a friend at work lent me his Ergodox EZ. The learning curve for someone who’d been trying freestyle for 30 years was tough, but I definitely prefer it now I’m accustomed.
Most ergo keyboard users are somewhat zealous, so if you know someone who uses one, they may be happy to lend you one on a temp basis.
I’ve got a Moonlander I’ve been using on and off for a while now, it’s hard to fully commit when I’m so comfortable typing on a 60% or 65%.
Agreed about people lending, I’ve let coworkers and friends borrow keyboards and even let some friends keep them because I have too many.
I’ve been trying so hard to get one, sadly where I live, this category is basically nonexistent.
I can’t get by without my lineages advantage 360 pro. It’s a ridiculous keyboard but the only one I’ve ever tried that hasn’t caused my arm to get inflamed after a days typing.
I built myself an Iris (v6 iirc) and I love it to pieces. I painted mine rainbow!
I also have an Iris! I haven’t tented mine and am trying to decide if I want to.
I’ve found it works fine for games, I usually just shove the right side of my keyboard out of the way for more mouse space, and just have a few extra mouse buttons to make up for not having the right side of the keyboard.
I set mine up with rotary encoders that give me up/down/left/right, so I don’t have to take my hands off my keyboard to move around within an open file.
I haven’t tented mine either, but have tossed around the idea a little bit.
I’ve used the ergodox ez for a couple of years, great device. Doing more with thumb is surprisingly convenient.
The small poles didn’t do a lot of tenting. I came from yogitype (vertical keyboard), would have liked more.
A few months ago i switched to kinesis 360. Love the tenting of that, the keys are also a pleasure to type on.
Biggest downside is that my laptop keyboard is now even more horrible.
I have the Dygma Raise, helped alleviate shoulder issues and RSI
I think they’re very good if you use your computer for a whole lot of typing and nothing else. Using a DVORAK keyboard instead of a QWERTY one will also improve your WPM and QoL when typing, once you’re used to it. If you’re a writer or a programmer, it’s worth considering.
But much like DVORAK vs QWERTY, any non-typing tasks become affected. It’s awkward playing PC games, for example, when some of your shortcuts for inventory/map are far enough from your kb hand to need your mouse hand. You also don’t have much range to choose from, so may have to make compromises on things like keypress feedback, simultaneous presses, unit price, etc.
I learned to touch-type on a tented keyboard with a mild split. When I replaced it, I got a ‘Wave’ keyboard - not split, but slightly tented, and had depressions and curves to match the wrist and the finger lengths at rest on the home row. Both of them were membrane keyboards (full-depth keypress). Despite being a membrane keyboard, the Wave was still as chunky and loud as most mechanical keyboards.
But now, I’m just using a generic full-length mechanical keyboard (partial keypress) with relatively quiet switches, one chosen as a good compromise between gaming (sensitivity) and typing (feedback). I’ve changed my resting position a little so that my wrists are still in an A shape (not an H shape), but I’m finding the keys much more comfortable.
The old ergonomic keyboards didn’t give much choice and in hindsight the feedback on the keys on the Wave felt AWFUL compared to what I use now. A split/tent mechanical keyboard might be different, but then price becomes a consideration. Swapping to a mechanical keyboard made the biggest difference to my comfort typing. (And don’t let tall/loud keys fool you - not every chunky keyboard is mechanical.)
Interesting take on the gaming aspect! I’ve decided to try out the Moonlander and gaming is my main task after programming (sometimes before lol). Hoping the customization software gets me around some of the issues with having the buttons too far away.
I use the Logitech ergonomic keyboard at work and love it. It does take some getting used to but it is definitely a more comfortable typing experience.
I built a Lily58 keyboard a couple years ago, and I love it. Coincidentally enough, I posted about it today on another thread about mechanical keyboards on yet another server.
But I love how it turned out. It’s super comfy, and I actually enjoy that I can put that keyboard around another keyboard I use for my ipad. So during the day while working I can still use my ipad easily. Super nice.
Here’s a link to the image I posted with that thread:
https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9184e3ce-60e3-443c-921b-8302d2a46bfb.jpeg
I’ve been thinking about getting a Moonlander for work. Been having some pain in my arms/shoulders/wrists after work. Would be my first split keyboard.
